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Ibnu Sirin believed al-Mahdi is better than Abu Bakar r.a and Umar r.a?


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#1 OFFLINE   Ahlusunnah

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Posted 25 August 2012 - 11:51 PM

Assalamualaikum, shia use the narration below




حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو أُسَامَةَ عَنْ عَوْفٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدٍ قَالَ يَكُونُ فِي هَذِهِ الأُمَّةِ خَلِيفَةٌ لاَ يُفَضَّلُ عَلَيْهِ أَبُو بَكْرٍ وَلاَ عُمَرُ

Rough translation: Narrated to us Abu Usamah from ‘Auf from Muhammad that he said “[Al Mahdi] is the Khalifah for this ummah, he cannot be  matched by Abu Bakar and  Umar [Al Mushannaf Ibnu Abi Syaibah 15/198 no 38805]

Shia said the narration is authenthic

What is your opinion?

anti-shia blog in malay

http://titian-sebenar.blogspot.com/

#2 OFFLINE   Efendi

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 01:03 AM

http://gift2shias.co...-some-prophets/

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#3 OFFLINE   Farid

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 01:17 AM

The chain seems fine.

Al-Suyuti explains this narration to refer to the amount of ajr that one gets for one's actions during the late times of fitan. As you are aware, this includes Al-Dajjal. He also bases his reasoning on a narration that states that people during those later times receive multiples upon multiples of ajr for their actions.

أرب يبول الثعلبان برأسه    لقد ذل من بالت عليه الثعالب


#4 OFFLINE   Farid

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 01:23 AM

Quote

On other note, there is another narration that is mentioned in the Musanaf of Abu Shayba from – supposingly – Ibn Sireen: يكون في هذه الأمة خليفة لا يفضل عليه أبو بكر و لا عمر
It is weak due to its discontinous chain of narrator and was transmitted through a thiqa but was shiaa!!


Since when did pro-Mahdi hadiths in Sunni hadith become Imami related?

أرب يبول الثعلبان برأسه    لقد ذل من بالت عليه الثعالب


#5 OFFLINE   Ebn Hussein

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 01:30 AM

Subhanallah such a munkar matn, even the reasoning is flawed.

Quote

Rough translation: Narrated to us Abu Usamah from ‘Auf from Muhammad that he said “[Al Mahdi] is the Khalifah for this ummah, he cannot be  matched by Abu Bakar and  Umar [Al Mushannaf Ibnu Abi Syaibah 15/198 no 38805].


So Al-Mahdi is the Khalifa of the Ummah, hence he cannot be matched  by the Shaytkhayn? red-hot new: The Shaykhayn were the Khulafa' of  this Ummah TOO!

But there is a lesson for us to learn: Rafidah are ready to throw the Qur'an over board, just for the sake of giving victory to their Zandaqah religion and belief in their 12th demigods:

They are ready to throw the Qur'an (the MAIN THAQL) over board (the very Qur'an that CLEARLY states that ALL the Prophet's have been favoured by Allah over ALL Mankind!)! Instead of throwing any narration against the wall that opposes the Qur'an (so called Rafidi principle) we see them (as usual) doing the exact opposite.

قال عبدالله بن المبارك - رحمه الله تعالى- : (الدين لأهل الحديث، والكلام والحيل لأهل الرأى، والكذب للرافضة

Imam Ibn Al-Mubarak (one of the Leading Imams of the Salaf) - رحمه الله تعالى- said: 'The Deen is for the Ahl Al-Hadith, Kalaam and tricks for the Ahl Al-Rai and lies are for the Rafidah'.


قد قيل فيما مضى في الحمق منزلة * للرافضـي فغـارت منكـم البقـر

لو أنني كنت فردا فـي عقيدتكـم * صعدت اعلى مباني الأرض انتحر


Mystical Batini Sufism and Rafidism, two sides of one coin: Barelvi Sufi founder, more Rafidi than many Rafidis
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ان شاء الله سوف اكون من اكبر أعداء السحلية التي دخلت السرداب يوما ولم تخرج منه حتى الآن اي عج عليه الذباب

#6 OFFLINE   swords_of_sunnah

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 11:25 AM

Brother Ayman bin khaled was spot on......
Allah is the MAULA of those who believe, whereas the disbelievers have no MAULA (Quran 47:11)

HASBUNALLAHU WA NEMAL WAKEEL, NEMAL MAULA WA NEMAN NASEER
Translation: "Allah (Alone) is Sufficient for us, and He is the Best Disposer of affairs (for us); what an Excellent Maula (Patron, Lord) and what an Excellent Helper!

#7 OFFLINE   Lover_of_Sahaba

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Posted 26 August 2012 - 01:02 PM

If he said that, good for him.
I believe personally that the Caliphate of Imam Abu Bakr siddiq, Imam Umar ibn al Khattab r.a, Imam Uthman ibn Affan r.a and Imam Ali ibn abi talib r.a were better than the caliphate of Imam Mahdi because of the following reasons:
1) they believed in the messenger of Allah swt when his tribe fought him
2) they made jihad against the polytheists
3) After the messenger of Allah pbuh died, they didnt leave the religion but spread it to else where, fought the persian polytheists and christian polytheists.


Tell me again what Imam Mahdi will do that is bigger than those?????
And if Sirin says Mahdi was better than them for the fact of fitnah and dajjal, then he should also say Isa pbuh is better than prophet Muhammad pbuh! Subhanallah
Imam Bukhari Rahimullah:
I don’t see any difference between praying Salah behind a Jahmi or a (Shia) Rafidhi and a Christian or a Jew. They (Jahmis/Rafidhis) are not to be greeted, nor are they to be visited, nor are they to be married, nor is their testimony to be accepted, nor are their sacrifices to be eaten.

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#8 OFFLINE   Farid

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 07:17 PM

I'd also like to add that there is an issue with the translation of the narration.

It says:




حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو أُسَامَةَ عَنْ عَوْفٍ عَنْ مُحَمَّدٍ قَالَ يَكُونُ فِي هَذِهِ الأُمَّةِ خَلِيفَةٌ لاَ يُفَضَّلُ عَلَيْهِ أَبُو بَكْرٍ وَلاَ عُمَرُ

Rough translation: Narrated to us Abu Usamah from ‘Auf from Muhammad that he said “[Al Mahdi] is the Khalifah for this ummah, he cannot be  matched by Abu Bakar and  Umar [Al Mushannaf Ibnu Abi Syaibah 15/198 no 38805]

It should be: In this Ummah will be a caliph and Abu Bakr and Omar will not be preferred over him.

I say (Farid): This doesn't necessarily mean that this is Ibn Sireen's view, but rather, that he believes that people will feel this way about this caliph.

Edited by Farid, 31 January 2013 - 07:19 PM.

أرب يبول الثعلبان برأسه    لقد ذل من بالت عليه الثعالب


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#9 OFFLINE   Hani

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 07:22 PM

Hey it's a point of view so what's the deal lol.

This same ibn Sireen believed that most of the narrations the people of Kufa attributed to `Ali (ra) are lies....
Religion = simple and clear.

عليك سلامُ الله منّا كلّما ثارَ ثائرٌ يا حُسين


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#10 OFFLINE   al-kulayni

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Posted 31 January 2013 - 11:10 PM

 Hani, on 31 January 2013 - 07:22 PM, said:

Hey it's a point of view so what's the deal lol.

This same ibn Sireen believed that most of the narrations the people of Kufa attributed to `Ali (ra) are lies....

Assalamu Aleykum Hani,

Could you bring his belief about narrations from people of kufa please ? barak Allah feek

#11 OFFLINE   Hani

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 12:20 AM

http://islamic-forum...showtopic=19505
Religion = simple and clear.

عليك سلامُ الله منّا كلّما ثارَ ثائرٌ يا حُسين


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#12 OFFLINE   Ebn Hussein

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 01:10 AM

Wallahi this is a major problem when you deal with the Rawafidh, their scholars and 'Awaam alike. They tell you Ibn Abbas hold on the validity of Nikah Al-Mut'a (even after it's abrogation), they tell you so-and-so Sahabi did this and so and so scholar said that ... They forgot that we are not the Shias and followers of the Sahaba (in every matter, especially in matters where their Ijtihad opposes clear-cut Nass/text), let alone of Ibn Sireen! Maybe Rafidha take their Deen from Ibn Sireen (Taqleed wise), we don't, especially not if man of much more weight stated the opposite (Ali, Ibn Omar etc. who all stated that Abu Bakr and Omar are the best of THIS UMMAH, the last Ummah until Qiyamah).

قال عبدالله بن المبارك - رحمه الله تعالى- : (الدين لأهل الحديث، والكلام والحيل لأهل الرأى، والكذب للرافضة

Imam Ibn Al-Mubarak (one of the Leading Imams of the Salaf) - رحمه الله تعالى- said: 'The Deen is for the Ahl Al-Hadith, Kalaam and tricks for the Ahl Al-Rai and lies are for the Rafidah'.


قد قيل فيما مضى في الحمق منزلة * للرافضـي فغـارت منكـم البقـر

لو أنني كنت فردا فـي عقيدتكـم * صعدت اعلى مباني الأرض انتحر


Mystical Batini Sufism and Rafidism, two sides of one coin: Barelvi Sufi founder, more Rafidi than many Rafidis
_______________
HCY resident since 2005, الحمد لله.
ان شاء الله سوف اكون من اكبر أعداء السحلية التي دخلت السرداب يوما ولم تخرج منه حتى الآن اي عج عليه الذباب





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